Comments on: One of “the great achievements of American literature”: Mormonism in Howe’s What Hath God Wrought, Part 1 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/ Fri, 10 Feb 2012 00:20:29 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Juvenile Instructor » Mormonism in What Hath God Wrought, Part 2 (Concluded) http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-30233 Juvenile Instructor » Mormonism in What Hath God Wrought, Part 2 (Concluded) Sat, 07 Mar 2009 21:06:36 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-30233 [...] my previous post on Howe’s What Hath God Wrought, I discussed Howe’s treatment of Mormon history from [...] [...] my previous post on Howe’s What Hath God Wrought, I discussed Howe’s treatment of Mormon history from [...]

]]> By: Howe on Mormonism « U.S. History, 1815-1848 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-28477 Howe on Mormonism « U.S. History, 1815-1848 Tue, 10 Feb 2009 20:59:55 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-28477 [...] hop on over to the Juvenile Instructor blog and check out this post on Howe’s treatment of Mormonism, and this one on Howe’s discussion of Mormon historians and historiography (in his [...] [...] hop on over to the Juvenile Instructor blog and check out this post on Howe’s treatment of Mormonism, and this one on Howe’s discussion of Mormon historians and historiography (in his [...]

]]> By: smb http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25720 smb Sat, 03 Jan 2009 01:48:20 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25720 I liked Howe. I think he proposed a useful synthesis of recent scholarship even if he didn't bring much new to the table on Mormonism. I thought he did a great job of integrating religious themes more generally. I think that Shipps was quoted primarily when there was not anything better, but her role I think was often a religious one, providing a space for Mormons to come to terms with themselves and building bridges with outsiders, a work of breaking out of the cult vs. Christianity model. Now that this has happened largely, there are new studies to be cited. There's not enough quality work on Mormon Indianism yet, but you're right that Howe would not be pleased to find Phelps arguing in the church organ that Removal was actually God gathering the Indians as lost Israel. Let's not e-mail him about that just yet. He did a great job of treating the Jacksonian genocide in fair but rigorous terms that aren't quite as overpowering as Howard Zinn (I like Zinn, but he's not much of a consensus-builder). You guys and your grade inflation--you're like a bunch of Ivy League professors bestowing A+s on students. Also, the Working Papers roster is starting to fill out with some interesting papers and presenters. Are the JI crew going to participate? I liked Howe. I think he proposed a useful synthesis of recent scholarship even if he didn’t bring much new to the table on Mormonism. I thought he did a great job of integrating religious themes more generally.

I think that Shipps was quoted primarily when there was not anything better, but her role I think was often a religious one, providing a space for Mormons to come to terms with themselves and building bridges with outsiders, a work of breaking out of the cult vs. Christianity model. Now that this has happened largely, there are new studies to be cited.

There’s not enough quality work on Mormon Indianism yet, but you’re right that Howe would not be pleased to find Phelps arguing in the church organ that Removal was actually God gathering the Indians as lost Israel. Let’s not e-mail him about that just yet. He did a great job of treating the Jacksonian genocide in fair but rigorous terms that aren’t quite as overpowering as Howard Zinn (I like Zinn, but he’s not much of a consensus-builder).

You guys and your grade inflation–you’re like a bunch of Ivy League professors bestowing A+s on students.

Also, the Working Papers roster is starting to fill out with some interesting papers and presenters. Are the JI crew going to participate?

]]> By: SC Taysom http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25705 SC Taysom Fri, 02 Jan 2009 21:27:42 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25705 Wait a minute. I think that we are giving short shrift to Ben's idea that Woodruff is 400 years old. I mean, have any of you actually <em>seen</em> his dead body? Were any of you scoffers present at his birth, which he claimed to have occurred on March 1, 1807? Ya, didn't think so. Preach on Ben. Wait a minute. I think that we are giving short shrift to Ben’s idea that Woodruff is 400 years old. I mean, have any of you actually seen his dead body? Were any of you scoffers present at his birth, which he claimed to have occurred on March 1, 1807? Ya, didn’t think so. Preach on Ben.

]]> By: David G. http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25698 David G. Fri, 02 Jan 2009 19:17:27 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25698 Or at least practice your proofreading skills. ;) Or at least practice your proofreading skills. ;)

]]> By: Ben http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25697 Ben Fri, 02 Jan 2009 19:16:57 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25697 yeah, think and not thought. with that comment and my "four centuries" comment, I think I need to get a full-time editor. yeah, think and not thought.

with that comment and my “four centuries” comment, I think I need to get a full-time editor.

]]> By: Ben http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25696 Ben Fri, 02 Jan 2009 19:15:52 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25696 "O kist tjoml" = "I just thought" Don't you know the "when-you-place-your-fingers-on-the-wrong-keys-and-don't-notice" language? “O kist tjoml” = “I just thought”

Don’t you know the “when-you-place-your-fingers-on-the-wrong-keys-and-don’t-notice” language?

]]> By: David G. http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25695 David G. Fri, 02 Jan 2009 19:14:58 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25695 Ah, I think with the help of the Urim and Thummim I've deciphered it. It's Benjian for "I just think" Ah, I think with the help of the Urim and Thummim I’ve deciphered it. It’s Benjian for “I just think”

]]> By: David G. http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25694 David G. Fri, 02 Jan 2009 19:12:30 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25694 <i>O kist tjoml</i> What langauge is that? O kist tjoml

What langauge is that?

]]> By: Ben http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-25691 Ben Fri, 02 Jan 2009 18:27:23 +0000 http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/one-of-the-great-achievements-of-american-literature-mormonism-in-howes-what-hath-god-wrought-part-1/#comment-25691 Chris: Gosh, your making me remember things when I don't have my book with me. Off the top of my head, I think I just found Howe's treatment as slightly simplistic and one dimensional--that his focus on millinarianism overshadowed other important theological features. It could just be personal preference, though. Anyways, I would have to look over it again. But I do understand that this approach is what fit within the intillectual framework he was going for--O kist tjoml there were more theological dimensions of "improvement" than just eschatology. Chris: Gosh, your making me remember things when I don’t have my book with me. Off the top of my head, I think I just found Howe’s treatment as slightly simplistic and one dimensional–that his focus on millinarianism overshadowed other important theological features. It could just be personal preference, though.

Anyways, I would have to look over it again. But I do understand that this approach is what fit within the intillectual framework he was going for–O kist tjoml there were more theological dimensions of “improvement” than just eschatology.

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