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	<title>Comments on: On writing Mormon women&#8217;s history</title>
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		<title>By: Steve Fleming</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42298</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Fleming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 15:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Just as a follow up, I did some digging around yesterday.  The letter was written by Mary Ann Jeffries.  Also there were two Sister McMinns in Philadelphia (a mother and daughter) and HCK married the daughter (Margaret) in 1846.  She did not go to Utah though.  Heber also married a Mary Ann Shefflin from Speedwell, New Jersey (in the Philadelphia area) that may have been this woman.  In 1854, Kimball wrote to a son that “Mary Ann Kimball has taken upon her her original name, Mary Ann Shefflin, as she could not endure any longer without having a man to herself, there were no tears on the subject; but the matter took its natural course.”  Stanley B. Kimball, &lt;em&gt;Heber C. Kimball: Mormon Patriarch and Pionee&lt;/em&gt;r (Urbana: University of Illinois Press, 1981), 310, 313.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just as a follow up, I did some digging around yesterday.  The letter was written by Mary Ann Jeffries.  Also there were two Sister McMinns in Philadelphia (a mother and daughter) and HCK married the daughter (Margaret) in 1846.  She did not go to Utah though.  Heber also married a Mary Ann Shefflin from Speedwell, New Jersey (in the Philadelphia area) that may have been this woman.  In 1854, Kimball wrote to a son that “Mary Ann Kimball has taken upon her her original name, Mary Ann Shefflin, as she could not endure any longer without having a man to herself, there were no tears on the subject; but the matter took its natural course.”  Stanley B. Kimball, <em>Heber C. Kimball: Mormon Patriarch and Pionee</em>r (Urbana: University of Illinois Press, 1981), 310, 313.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan T</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42273</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 06:36:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>If you&#039;re interested in looking at the context of female preaching outside the LDS tradtition, perhaps the most prominent authority is Catherine Brekus at U of Chicago. See her &lt;em&gt;Strangers and Pilgrims: Female Preaching in America, 1740-1845&lt;/em&gt; (Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press, 1998). She also edited an important volume recently entitled &lt;em&gt;The Religious History of American Women&lt;/em&gt; (Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press, 2007), which contains an essay on theology in Mormon women&#039;s literature by Susanna Morrill. Brekus will be the keynote at MHA next year...I&#039;m looking forward to what she has to say about Mormon women.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you&#8217;re interested in looking at the context of female preaching outside the LDS tradtition, perhaps the most prominent authority is Catherine Brekus at U of Chicago. See her <em>Strangers and Pilgrims: Female Preaching in America, 1740-1845</em> (Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press, 1998). She also edited an important volume recently entitled <em>The Religious History of American Women</em> (Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press, 2007), which contains an essay on theology in Mormon women&#8217;s literature by Susanna Morrill. Brekus will be the keynote at MHA next year&#8230;I&#8217;m looking forward to what she has to say about Mormon women.</p>
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		<title>By: Jared T</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42198</link>
		<dc:creator>Jared T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 04:43:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Great post, Steve. I don&#039;t have anything to add, but I&#039;m glad to see that women are getting a closer look.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post, Steve. I don&#8217;t have anything to add, but I&#8217;m glad to see that women are getting a closer look.</p>
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		<title>By: JonW</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42194</link>
		<dc:creator>JonW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 03:56:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>amazing the kind of things you can find.  I love it when you find intriguing nuggets of information.  You start to really wonder what on earth was really being said.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>amazing the kind of things you can find.  I love it when you find intriguing nuggets of information.  You start to really wonder what on earth was really being said.</p>
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		<title>By: Rick Grunder</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42181</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick Grunder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 01:55:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Nancy Towle had, in turn, been inspired by Freewill Baptist evangelist Clarissa H. Danforth.  Another example was Susan Humes, mentioned by David Marks in conjunction with Danforth and itinerant preacher Abel Thornton.  And Lorenzo Dow&#039;s wife Peggy, though not a preacher, traveled with Lorenzo faithfully under sometimes arduous circumstances.  When teen-aged David Marks, something of a Dow &quot;groupie,&quot; followed Lorenzo to Tully, New York, he found a dinner place set for him at the local tavern between Lorenzo and Peggy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nancy Towle had, in turn, been inspired by Freewill Baptist evangelist Clarissa H. Danforth.  Another example was Susan Humes, mentioned by David Marks in conjunction with Danforth and itinerant preacher Abel Thornton.  And Lorenzo Dow&#8217;s wife Peggy, though not a preacher, traveled with Lorenzo faithfully under sometimes arduous circumstances.  When teen-aged David Marks, something of a Dow &#8220;groupie,&#8221; followed Lorenzo to Tully, New York, he found a dinner place set for him at the local tavern between Lorenzo and Peggy.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Fleming</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42161</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Fleming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 20:33:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/?p=2000#comment-42161</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think anything else will turn up (in the Delaware Valley, that&#039;s all I&#039;m doing). I&#039;ve been at this for a long time (10 years!).  I can&#039;t believe that she meant that she was going to go traveling, I would find that inconceivable.  She has to mean doing something local in Philadelphia (where she lived.)

No doubt this was rare if not singular, the fact that she had ditched her unbelieving husband before gathering (also very rare) may give us some insights.  No one filled any reports to mission presidents at this time in this area, and I&#039;ve been through all the journals and letters.  

This is what I&#039;ve written about women&#039;s roles in the 1850s in the area.  For this period I&#039;m able to use Samuel Woolley&#039;s journal which as very detailed.  



&lt;blockquote&gt;Shortly after his arrival in Delaware, Samuel Woolley “went to a quaker [sic] meeting with Aunt Sarah, had a short discourse from a woman first, &amp; then from a man, as they think it is as much the right of a woman to preach as a man.” Though Woolley indicates in this passage that he considered such peculiar—despite his own Quaker background—women frequently spoke in the local Mormon meetings.  Woolley described the first meeting at Centerville as follows: “The most of the members of the Church met here in the capacity of a communion meeting, I spoke some time to them, Bro Forman make some very fine remarks, Sister McCullah prayed, Sister Margaret Carpenter spoke, Sister Sarah Mariah Mousley sang a hymn, so all done as St Paul said ‘if any have the spirit of exhortation, let them exhort, &amp; if any have a Psalm (Hymn) let sing it.’”  Women continued to speak in the meetings throughout Woolley’s stay.  Yet Woolley seemed to draw a distinction between speaking and preaching.  Women never spoke at the Sunday evening proselytizing meetings and Woolley instructed the Mormons in Centerville to “Give all a chance to speak, pray, or sing, as the spirit may dictate,” at their communion meetings, but “if unbelievers come in to hear” the males leaders were to preach to them.   Thus while men acted in all official capacities in Mormon worship, women could play a charismatic role if so moved by the spirit.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think anything else will turn up (in the Delaware Valley, that&#8217;s all I&#8217;m doing). I&#8217;ve been at this for a long time (10 years!).  I can&#8217;t believe that she meant that she was going to go traveling, I would find that inconceivable.  She has to mean doing something local in Philadelphia (where she lived.)</p>
<p>No doubt this was rare if not singular, the fact that she had ditched her unbelieving husband before gathering (also very rare) may give us some insights.  No one filled any reports to mission presidents at this time in this area, and I&#8217;ve been through all the journals and letters.  </p>
<p>This is what I&#8217;ve written about women&#8217;s roles in the 1850s in the area.  For this period I&#8217;m able to use Samuel Woolley&#8217;s journal which as very detailed.  </p>
<blockquote><p>Shortly after his arrival in Delaware, Samuel Woolley “went to a quaker [sic] meeting with Aunt Sarah, had a short discourse from a woman first, &#038; then from a man, as they think it is as much the right of a woman to preach as a man.” Though Woolley indicates in this passage that he considered such peculiar—despite his own Quaker background—women frequently spoke in the local Mormon meetings.  Woolley described the first meeting at Centerville as follows: “The most of the members of the Church met here in the capacity of a communion meeting, I spoke some time to them, Bro Forman make some very fine remarks, Sister McCullah prayed, Sister Margaret Carpenter spoke, Sister Sarah Mariah Mousley sang a hymn, so all done as St Paul said ‘if any have the spirit of exhortation, let them exhort, &#038; if any have a Psalm (Hymn) let sing it.’”  Women continued to speak in the meetings throughout Woolley’s stay.  Yet Woolley seemed to draw a distinction between speaking and preaching.  Women never spoke at the Sunday evening proselytizing meetings and Woolley instructed the Mormons in Centerville to “Give all a chance to speak, pray, or sing, as the spirit may dictate,” at their communion meetings, but “if unbelievers come in to hear” the males leaders were to preach to them.   Thus while men acted in all official capacities in Mormon worship, women could play a charismatic role if so moved by the spirit.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: smb</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42157</link>
		<dc:creator>smb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 20:25:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Towles&#039; memoir is very useful.  she calls herself non-denominational but is clearly mostly an Independent Baptist.  She has wonderful adventures where she meets other female itinerants and reflects on what it means to be a female preacher. she also gets in fights with Presbygationalist ministers and even wins some over.  I agree with Chris that female preachers are occasionally found outside orthodoxy but generally not within.  Douglas&#039;s Feminization of America is a standard treatment of ways women worked to shape power within evangelicalism.  I know i&#039;ve seen a secondary treatment of female preaching in the nineteenth century but can&#039;t remember details.  I have a memory that Lorenzo Dow sponsored various female itinerants (though this may be merely my inference from Towle&#039;s memoir).

For the LDS, I would recommend looking over material from the greats like ERS, Zina Diantha, Emmeline BW, and others.  Whitney was characterized as having great power in glossolalia, which was a form of preaching then. Might be worth scanning glossolalia material.

Prof. Laurel Thatcher Ulrich is the contemporary master of inference from womens&#039; diaries--I would recommend her oeuvre for orientation in the techniques.

I also am trying to do a better job of including female voices in my work.  Takes a lot more energy though--the lazy approach is the male-dominated one.

You might also check on the work of Susanna Morrill or Rachel Cope, both young PhDs who have done excellent work on female religious experience in the period (Mormon and evangelical respectively).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Towles&#8217; memoir is very useful.  she calls herself non-denominational but is clearly mostly an Independent Baptist.  She has wonderful adventures where she meets other female itinerants and reflects on what it means to be a female preacher. she also gets in fights with Presbygationalist ministers and even wins some over.  I agree with Chris that female preachers are occasionally found outside orthodoxy but generally not within.  Douglas&#8217;s Feminization of America is a standard treatment of ways women worked to shape power within evangelicalism.  I know i&#8217;ve seen a secondary treatment of female preaching in the nineteenth century but can&#8217;t remember details.  I have a memory that Lorenzo Dow sponsored various female itinerants (though this may be merely my inference from Towle&#8217;s memoir).</p>
<p>For the LDS, I would recommend looking over material from the greats like ERS, Zina Diantha, Emmeline BW, and others.  Whitney was characterized as having great power in glossolalia, which was a form of preaching then. Might be worth scanning glossolalia material.</p>
<p>Prof. Laurel Thatcher Ulrich is the contemporary master of inference from womens&#8217; diaries&#8211;I would recommend her oeuvre for orientation in the techniques.</p>
<p>I also am trying to do a better job of including female voices in my work.  Takes a lot more energy though&#8211;the lazy approach is the male-dominated one.</p>
<p>You might also check on the work of Susanna Morrill or Rachel Cope, both young PhDs who have done excellent work on female religious experience in the period (Mormon and evangelical respectively).</p>
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		<title>By: Ardis E. Parshall</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42154</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardis E. Parshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 20:16:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/?p=2000#comment-42154</guid>
		<description>Early converts, including women very often went out preaching -- really, door-to-door tracting and testifying. &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/06/29/johanna-tippett-porter-in-active-service-to-the-end-redux/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Johanna Tippett Porter&lt;/a&gt; and her mother Mary Ann did it; so did &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/08/19/a-day-in-the-life-of-a-sister-missionary-in-london-1852/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; Elizabeth Jefford Drake&lt;/a&gt; -- those women were in England. Polly Aird, “Without Purse or Scrip in Scotland,” &lt;em&gt;Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought&lt;/em&gt; 39:2 (Summer 2006), 46-69, reports on male converts in Scotland who did that kind of work. I have a letter from 1854 showing that Henri Edouard Desaules was doing the same thing in Switzerland.

I haven&#039;t noticed an example of a woman in the U.S. doing it, or anybody at all doing it quite this early, and am very happy to read of this instance. I suspect it was not uncommon, but that we don&#039;t know about it other than in diaries and letters because these were all unofficial missionaries, out warning their neighbors as the scriptures said, but not filing reports with a mission president.

Nice find!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Early converts, including women very often went out preaching &#8212; really, door-to-door tracting and testifying. <a href="http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/06/29/johanna-tippett-porter-in-active-service-to-the-end-redux/" rel="nofollow">Johanna Tippett Porter</a> and her mother Mary Ann did it; so did <a href="http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/08/19/a-day-in-the-life-of-a-sister-missionary-in-london-1852/" rel="nofollow"> Elizabeth Jefford Drake</a> &#8212; those women were in England. Polly Aird, “Without Purse or Scrip in Scotland,” <em>Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought</em> 39:2 (Summer 2006), 46-69, reports on male converts in Scotland who did that kind of work. I have a letter from 1854 showing that Henri Edouard Desaules was doing the same thing in Switzerland.</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t noticed an example of a woman in the U.S. doing it, or anybody at all doing it quite this early, and am very happy to read of this instance. I suspect it was not uncommon, but that we don&#8217;t know about it other than in diaries and letters because these were all unofficial missionaries, out warning their neighbors as the scriptures said, but not filing reports with a mission president.</p>
<p>Nice find!</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42151</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 20:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/?p=2000#comment-42151</guid>
		<description>This is really interesting stuff, Steve. Thanks for sharing it here. I have never seen a similar statement from another early LDS woman, but am curious about whatever you can find (or anyone else can share).

I&#039;m especially interested in the language used. &quot;go out preaching soon&quot; seems to imply traveling to me. Is that how you read it, Steve?

David, some Methodist women preached, yes, though most only as &quot;exhorters&quot; within a given class. Very few ever assumed any sort of status as a traveling preacher (though some did accompany their husbands on their circuits and would exhort at gatherings). Phoebe Palmer is probably the most famous Methodist female preacher in antebellum America. Female exhorters and preachers were a source of contention within the MEC, though. There also are some notable black female preachers in 19th century Methodism (i.e. Jarena Lee).

There were a few independent female preachers that I&#039;m aware of. Nancy Towles comes to mind, for example (though I think she was affiliated with the Baptists).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is really interesting stuff, Steve. Thanks for sharing it here. I have never seen a similar statement from another early LDS woman, but am curious about whatever you can find (or anyone else can share).</p>
<p>I&#8217;m especially interested in the language used. &#8220;go out preaching soon&#8221; seems to imply traveling to me. Is that how you read it, Steve?</p>
<p>David, some Methodist women preached, yes, though most only as &#8220;exhorters&#8221; within a given class. Very few ever assumed any sort of status as a traveling preacher (though some did accompany their husbands on their circuits and would exhort at gatherings). Phoebe Palmer is probably the most famous Methodist female preacher in antebellum America. Female exhorters and preachers were a source of contention within the MEC, though. There also are some notable black female preachers in 19th century Methodism (i.e. Jarena Lee).</p>
<p>There were a few independent female preachers that I&#8217;m aware of. Nancy Towles comes to mind, for example (though I think she was affiliated with the Baptists).</p>
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		<title>By: David G.</title>
		<link>http://www.juvenileinstructor.org/on-writing-mormon-womens-history/comment-page-1/#comment-42147</link>
		<dc:creator>David G.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 19:35:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Ah, the riches of the Church Archives. The longer I&#039;m away from Utah, the more I realize we have an embarassment of riches up there. Thanks for walking us through this, Steve.

As to your larger point, I&#039;ve never seen anything about Mormon women preaching. How common was this in antebellum America at large? I imagine Quaker women preached. Did Methodists, Chris?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, the riches of the Church Archives. The longer I&#8217;m away from Utah, the more I realize we have an embarassment of riches up there. Thanks for walking us through this, Steve.</p>
<p>As to your larger point, I&#8217;ve never seen anything about Mormon women preaching. How common was this in antebellum America at large? I imagine Quaker women preached. Did Methodists, Chris?</p>
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